#68 - God Bless Bitcoin: Interview With Brian and Kelly Estes

September 2, 2024

#68 - God Bless Bitcoin: Interview With Brian and Kelly Estes

Unfiltered Union

Hosts Russ and Linz begin the episode with a playful discussion about their morning routines and a humorous debate about ice cream versus iced coffee, before transitioning into a substantive conversation about Bitcoin. They introduce their interview with Brian and Kelly Estes, creators of the documentary 'God Bless Bitcoin', expressing their initial curiosity and limited understanding of cryptocurrency.

In the interview, Brian and Kelly Estes explain their motivation for creating the film, which explores Bitcoin through the lens of various world religions, examining money's ethical and moral dimensions. They discuss how the current monetary system dilutes individual wealth through continuous printing of money, causing significant economic challenges for middle-class families. The couple emphasizes Bitcoin as a more ethical alternative to traditional currency, comparing it to a digital version of gold with unique advantages like portability and finite supply.

The conversation delves into Bitcoin's potential global impact, with the Estes projecting that by 2029, 90% of Americans will own Bitcoin. They argue that the transition will be natural, similar to how humans historically adopted gold and silver as monetary standards. The interview concludes with a call for education and open-mindedness, encouraging listeners to learn more about Bitcoin's potential to provide financial protection and challenge the current economic system.

Podcast Title

Unfiltered Union

Host

Russ and Lindz

Publish Date

September 2, 2024

Categories

Episode Notes

In this engaging podcast episode, Russ and Lindz discuss fun and quirky topics like enjoying iced coffee in the shower before transitioning to an in-depth interview with Brian and Kelly Estes, creators of the film 'God Bless Bitcoin.' The Estes explain their motivation behind the film, blending educational themes about the ethical implications of Bitcoin and its integration with various religious perspectives. The conversation covers the history, moral advantages, and future implications of Bitcoin as a superior monetary system, touching on economic challenges and the potential for a global transition to Bitcoin.

Timestamps:

00:00 Revelations and Shower Ideas

02:08 Bitcoin Basics: The White Paper

03:27 Bitcoin's Complexities and Interview Introduction

05:02 Meet Brian and Kelly Estes

07:08 The Intersection of Religion and Bitcoin

13:42 Bitcoin's Ethical and Moral Dimensions

20:16 The Future of Money: Bitcoin's Potential

25:47 Concluding Thoughts and Resources

Guest Info:

Brian Estes is the CIO of Off the Chain Capital which manages the #1 performing blockchain fund in the Hedge Fund Research (HFR) Universe from 2016-2021. Brian has been a VC in blockchain for 10 years and has advised, mentored and/or financed 6 blockchain companies that have a combined value of over $50B today. In addition to running blockchain asset funds, he teaches blockchain and digital asset investing classes at University of Cambridge UK, Washington University, and Morgan State University’s Center of Blockchain and Financial Technology. Brian earned his BA in Economics from the University of Illinois, his MBA from Washington University in St. Louis with high honors, and did is study abroad at University of Cambridge and the London School of Economics. For fun Brian has been an active pilot and aircraft owner for 34 years and has over 2200 hours of flight time logged.

Kelly Estes is founder and President of the Great Big Beautiful Tomorrow Foundation, a non-profit that provides bridge scholarships to private high schools and colleges for high-need, high-achieving students to help break the cycle of poverty through education. Kelly has devoted the last thirty years to education as a teacher and as the Graduate Support Director of an enrichment program that provided programming and advisement in a school district where 95% of the students grew up in generational poverty.

Studio | Film:  All About 360 God Bless Bitcoin

Release Date: July 25th (AVAILABLE FOR FREE)

Trailer | Site: ⁠God Bless Bitcoin⁠

Synopsis:  God Bless Bitcoin asks the timely question: How do we fix our broken money? Through in-depth conversations with blockchain and interfaith leaders (including Mark Cuban, Cathie Wood, Rabbi Michael Caras, Fr. Robert Sirico, Tony Hawk, Tim Draper, the film exposes the broken, unjust, and immoral nature of our current fiat-based monetary system, one that is intimately connected to the military industrial complex and the propagation of war. The film also shows how and why members of the poor and middle class feel an financial squeeze even when they work hard and lead fiscally responsible lives. God Bless Bitcoin ultimately suggests the ways in which Bitcoin can present alternatives to our current system that are more just, equitable, and peaceful.

  1. Bitcoin emerged from a nine-page white paper by Satoshi Nakamoto in 2008 and represents a potentially transformative digital monetary system

  2. The current fiat monetary system is fundamentally flawed, with governments continuously printing money that devalues citizens' earnings and savings

  3. Bitcoin offers a more ethical and moral form of currency with a fixed supply of 21 million coins, preventing inflationary debasement

  4. Religious perspectives from multiple faiths (Christianity, Judaism, Islam, Buddhism) support Bitcoin as a more just monetary system that respects human labor and wealth

  5. Bitcoin functions like a digital version of gold - portable, divisible, verifiable, and not controllable by any single government or institution

  6. Projected Bitcoin adoption could reach 90% of Americans by 2029, suggesting a significant shift in monetary understanding and technology

  7. Inflation threatens middle-class purchasing power, with the same work producing less economic value over time, while Bitcoin could serve as a protective financial shield

  8. Education is critical to Bitcoin adoption, with currently only 1% of the global population understanding its potential and mechanisms

  1. "Bitcoin is basically a digital version of gold... It's basically gold with wings on it."  - Brian Estes

    - A succinct and memorable analogy that helps simplify the complex concept of Bitcoin for everyday listeners

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  2. "If you take and work and earn extra dollars and you store them in bitcoin, that bitcoin can't be diluted like your dollars could be diluted. So it keeps you up with inflation. It's like a shield."  - Brian Estes

    - Provides a clear, practical explanation of Bitcoin's potential value as a hedge against inflation

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  3. "Our money has been diluted. We're working just as hard, and we're not getting the same benefit from that work."  - Brian Estes

    - A powerful critique of the current monetary system that resonates with many workers experiencing economic pressure

    Share to:

  4. "Bitcoin itself is simple, as in like it. To me, understanding bitcoin itself is not difficult. Understanding the capabilities of bitcoin, that's where it starts getting complex."  - Russ

    - Offers an insightful perspective on the perceived complexity of Bitcoin

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  5. "It's either that or you bet your wealth on a system that's been broken for a very long time, which is our standard financial system that's currently destroying families, lives, jobs, everything."  - Russ

    - A provocative statement that challenges the current monetary system and positions Bitcoin as an alternative

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Chapter 1: Shower Thoughts and Bitcoin Curiosity

Russ and Linz begin their podcast with playful banter about shower habits and iced beverages, then transition into a discussion about Bitcoin, highlighting Russ's early interest in the cryptocurrency and the origin of its foundational white paper.

  • Bitcoin originated from a nine-page white paper that proposed a peer-to-peer digital cash system.
  • Russ and Linz approach the topic of Bitcoin with curiosity and a desire to understand its broader implications.

Key Quotes

  1. "The bitcoin white paper was released on October 31st in 2008." by Russ

    - This quote provides a precise historical reference point for Bitcoin's inception

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  2. "You can't just print money out of thin air." by Russ

    - This quote succinctly captures Russ's fundamental criticism of traditional monetary systems

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Chapter 2: God Bless Bitcoin: Exploring the Film's Origins

Brian and Kelly Estes discuss their motivations for creating the documentary, highlighting Brian's initial curiosity about religious perspectives on money and Kelly's background in education and financial literacy. They explain how their personal experiences and professional backgrounds converged to inspire the film.

  • The film aims to explore monetary systems through the lens of different religious perspectives.
  • Education and understanding are critical to helping people comprehend Bitcoin's potential.

Key Quotes

  1. "The base layer of morals and ethics are the world's religions and their sacred scriptures. That is where we as humans are taught morality and ethics." by Kelly Estes

    - This quote explains the foundational approach of examining money through a moral and ethical lens

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  2. "All bitcoin is, is software, and it's freedom technology." by Brian Estes

    - This quote encapsulates the broader technological and philosophical perspective on Bitcoin

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Chapter 3: Religious Perspectives and the Mark of the Beast

The Estes address common religious concerns about Bitcoin, particularly the misconception that it might represent the biblical 'mark of the beast'. They provide nuanced theological insights and explain why Bitcoin could be viewed as a more ethical monetary system aligned with religious principles.

  • Religious texts should not be used to create fear or make speculative interpretations about modern technologies.
  • Bitcoin can be viewed as a potentially more ethical monetary system that aligns with religious principles of fairness and value.

Key Quotes

  1. "The Book of Revelation is to remind us to be ever vigilant and to stay in his word, not to try to interpret signs of anything going on today in modern culture." by Kelly Estes

    - This quote provides a thoughtful theological perspective on interpreting religious texts

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  2. "Bitcoin's basically a digital version of gold." by Brian Estes

    - This quote simplifies Bitcoin's concept by comparing it to a familiar historical form of money

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Chapter 4: The Broken Monetary System and Bitcoin's Potential

Brian and Kelly Estes critique the current monetary system, explaining how continuous money printing has eroded purchasing power and created economic challenges for middle-class families. They present Bitcoin as a potential solution that can protect individual wealth and provide economic stability.

  • The current monetary system requires continuous money printing, which devalues currency and increases economic pressure on workers.
  • Bitcoin offers a potential alternative that can protect individual wealth from systematic inflation.

Key Quotes

  1. "We have to print $200 trillion. And what that means is if more money gets printed, then everything becomes more expensive because the dollars don't buy as much." by Brian Estes

    - This quote provides a stark explanation of economic inflation and its long-term consequences

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  2. "Now you have to work harder to be able to have the same purchasing power." by Kelly Estes

    - This quote succinctly describes the economic pressure faced by workers in an inflationary system

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Chapter 5: The Future of Bitcoin and Global Adoption

The Estes discuss the potential trajectory of Bitcoin adoption, emphasizing education as the key to broader understanding and acceptance. They provide projections for Bitcoin's growth and explain how it might naturally integrate into global financial systems.

  • Bitcoin adoption is expected to grow significantly, with projections suggesting 90% of Americans might own Bitcoin by 2029.
  • Education and maintaining an open mind are crucial for understanding and potentially adopting new monetary technologies.

Key Quotes

  1. "Only 1% of the world understands Bitcoin today. It's projected by 2029. So just in five more years, 90% of Americans will own bitcoin." by Brian Estes

    - This quote provides a concrete projection of Bitcoin's potential growth

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  2. "I believe knowledge is power. And if you can just keep an open mind and then use this as a springboard to go educate yourself more so that you become more comfortable with this new form of money, I would say our movie had done its job." by Kelly Estes

    - This quote emphasizes the importance of education and open-mindedness in understanding new technologies

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Note: This transcript was automatically generated using speech recognition technology. While we will make minor corrections on request, transcriptions do not currently go through a full human review process. We apologize for any errors in the automated transcript.

Russ

Foreign.

This

is

the

Unfiltered

Union.

Linz

I'm

Linz.

Russ

And

I'm

Russ.

Linz

Here

is

this

week's

episode.

So

I

had

a

revelation

today

that's.

Russ

Kind

of

an

inappropriate

start.

Okay,

revelations.

Linz

We'll

get

there.

But

no,

today.

A

few

weeks

ago,

you

mentioned

having

ice

cream

shower

at

shower

ice

cream.

Yeah,

100

as

a

way

to

cool

off.

Russ

Very,

very

smart

idea.

Linz

I'm

gonna

one

up

you.

Russ

I

doubt

that's

gonna

happen,

but

let

me

hear

it.

Linz

Iced

coffee

in

the

shower.

Russ

That

sounds

pretty

good.

Linz

I

was

so

excited.

It

was

so

good.

Russ

So

did

you

take

a

cold

shower

with

iced

coffee

to

cool

off?

Because,

I

mean,

cold

in

Florida

is

cold.

Water

in

Florida

is

like

90

degrees.

Linz

No,

I'm

one

of

those

girls

that

takes

hot

showers.

I

can't

help

it.

Russ

So

you

just.

You

did

lava,

right?

Linz

I

did

lava,

but

I

had

my

iced

coffee

so

it

like

counterbalanced.

Russ

It's

like

driving

around

with

the

AC

on

and

the

windows

down.

Linz

Yeah,

it's

awesome.

Russ

No,

it

isn't.

Linz

Why?

Russ

Because

it's

a

waste.

Linz

Someone

said

letting

the

bot

air

out.

Russ

Yeah.

Oh,

Robo

air.

Linz

That

makes

sense.

You

good?

Russ

No,

I'm

just

not

feeling

it

today.

Linz

I

can

tell.

Good

grief.

Well,

I

think

it

was

a

great

idea

to

have

iced

coffee.

Russ

It's

a

good

idea.

But

it

does

not.

You

said

you1

upped

me,

and

I

don't

think

that's

a

one

up.

Linz

Oh,

I

100%

think

it's

a

one

up.

I

don't

like

ice

cream.

Russ

Yeah,

but

that's.

That's

your

funk.

Linz

Everybody

likes

iced

coffee.

If

you're

a

millennial,

you're

drinking

iced

coffee.

Russ

If

you're

a

human,

you're

eating

ice

cream.

Linz

That's

not

true.

I

prefer

cookies.

Cookies

are

the

superior

dessert.

Russ

Okay,

One

person

in

the

whole

world.

Linz

Okay.

I'm

sure

lactose

intolerant

people

agree

with

me.

Russ

No,

I

bet

you

they

still

like

ice

cream.

They

just

can't

eat

it.

Linz

Fine.

The

whole

point

in

today's

podcast

is

not

about

shower

ice

cream

or

shower

coffee.

We're

going

to

interview

some

fine

people,

but

we're

going

to

start

first

and

talk

about

bitcoin.

Russ

Why

bitcoin?

Linz

I

don't

know.

So

bitcoin

all

started

with

a

nine

page

white

paper,

right?

Russ

Satoshi

Nakamoto

released

a

nine

page

white

paper

in

2009,

I

believe

is

what

it

was,

and

outlined

a

peer

to

peer

cash,

digital

cash

system.

Linz

The

fact

that

you

just

said

all

that

while

staring

off

into

the

distance

was

kind

of

impressive.

Russ

It's

a

passion

of

Mine.

Linz

I,

I

hear

you,

but

the

idea

that

bitcoin

is

based

off

a

nine

page

white

paper,

when

it

is

this

very

complex

theory.

Russ

Yeah,

it's

complex,

but

it's

also

simple

at

the

same

time.

Linz

You

can't,

you

can't.

That's

like

saying

the,

the

Rubik's

cubes

are

complex

but

simple.

They're

not.

Russ

Well,

the,

the

bitcoin

itself

is

simple,

as

in

like

it.

To

me,

understanding

bitcoin

itself

is

not

difficult.

Understanding

the

capabilities

of

bitcoin,

that's

where

it

starts

getting

complex.

Linz

If

you

say

so.

Russ

That's

why

we

are

interviewing

the

people

we

are

interviewing

today.

Linz

Well,

it

just

blows

my

mind.

Like

a

nine

page

white

paper

is

what

we

are

going

to,

are

what

some

people

are

basing

all

of

their

wealth

off

of.

Russ

Right.

Linz

That's

crazy.

Yeah,

well,

it

not

crazy

like

you're

insane,

but

like

that's,

that's

a

big

concept

shrunk

down

to

nine

pages

and

you're

betting

all

of

your

wealth

on

it.

Russ

Well,

it's

either

that

or

you

bet

your

wealth

on

a

system

that's

been

broken

for

a

very

long

time,

which

is

our

standard

financial

system

that's

currently

destroying

families,

lives,

jobs,

everything.

Linz

Mic

drop.

Russ

Well,

I

mean

that,

that's,

that's,

that's

why

I

was

interested

in

interviewing

this,

this

power

couple.

Linz

Yeah.

Russ

That

we're

bringing

on

today.

Linz

Well,

first

of

all,

when

we

talked

about

bitcoin,

just

you

and

me

way

back

then,

you

were

trying

to

convince

me

into

buying

it.

Russ

Yeah.

Don't

regret

saying

no.

Linz

When

Was

that?

Russ

About

2010?

Ish.

Linz

Was

it?

Russ

Yeah.

Linz

So

after

the

white

paper

came

out,

you

had

decided

or

you

started

researching

that

you

found

it

and

you

were

like,

oh,

we

should

get

it.

And

I

was

like,

that's

fake.

Russ

Yeah.

Right.

Well,

and

plus,

back

then

it

was

a

lot

harder

to

buy

it

than

it

is

now.

Linz

Okay.

Russ

It

was

like

there

was

a

strange

weird

ways

to

go

about

it.

And

back

then

it

was

kind

of

doing

online

transactions.

A

lot

of

people

were

hesitant

because

of

fraud

and

all

that,

which,

look

at

us

now.

That's

all

we

do,

right?

Linz

Doordash.

Here's

my

money.

But

I

think

the

individuals

like

you

mentioned

that

we

are

going

to

discuss

or

meet

today,

they

produced

a

movie

called

God

Bless

Bitcoin

and

these

individuals,

Brian

and

Kelly

Estes,

are

going

to

be

our

interviewees

today.

Russ

They

are.

And

just

before

we

break

down

into

this,

I

wanted

to

fact

check

myself.

The

bitcoin

white

paper

was

released

on

October

31st

in

2008.

Linz

Dang.

Russ

So

not

2009.

I

was

mistaken.

Linz

How

dare

you.

Russ

I'm

human.

Linz

Gosh.

Russ

I

eat

ice

cream

in

the

shower.

Linz

I

have

iced

coffee

in

the

shower.

But

Brian

and

Kelly

Estes

for

the

God

Bless

bitcoin

movie.

Yes,

we

watched

it.

Russ

It

was

amazing.

Linz

It

has

really

good

production

value

for

being

almost

like

a

documentary.

Russ

Right.

I

think

that's

kind

of

part

of

what

has

been

missing

for

bitcoin

adoption

was

these

types

of

movies

and

documentaries.

People,

I

guess

they,

A

lot

of

people

don't

take

it

seriously

enough

yet.

But

I

think

these

types

of

films

are

going

to

bring

more

seriousness

to

the

conversation.

It's

like

people

are

spending

money

to

promote

bitcoin

now.

Like

a

lot

of

money.

This,

this

film

was

amazingly

done.

It

had

a

lot

of

people

in

it

had

Mark

Cuban

in

it.

It

had

Tony

Hawk

in

it,

talking

about

bitcoin

and

why

it's.

Why

it

can

change

the

world.

RFK

Jr.

Was

in

it.

Linz

You

know

who

wasn't

in

it?

Russ

Who?

Linz

Was

Elon

in

it?

Russ

No.

Linz

I'm

surprised.

Russ

I'm

not.

I

don't

know.

He's

kind

of

wish.

I'm

not

going

to

say

he's

wishy

washy

on

bitcoin,

but

he's.

He.

He

pushes

some

coins.

Yeah.

Linz

Whatever

it's

called.

Russ

Yeah,

he

pushes

that

kind

of

stuff,

which

is

he

can

do

whatever

he.

Linz

Wants,

but

obviously

it's.

Russ

Yeah.

Linz

But

I

mean,

overall,

I

think

what

we.

What

I

hope

to

get

out

of

the

interview

today

is

to

talk

to

them

about,

like,

what

drove

them

to

this.

And

then

there's

a.

Of

theming

around

religion.

Russ

Yeah.

I

thought

that

was

really

cool.

Linz

But

it's

not

just

one

secular

religion.

Right.

Russ

They.

Linz

They

covered

the

big

ones.

Right.

Russ

Buddhism,

Islam,

Christianity

and

Judaism.

Right.

Linz

Yep.

All

of

those

are.

All

have

a

representative

from

that

religious

sect

and

giving

their

point

of

view

on

bitcoin,

like,

that's

it.

That's

an

interesting

perspective.

Russ

Yeah.

They

woven,

you

know,

scripture

into

the

scenes

and

the

scene

changes

and

then

talked

about

how

the

scripture

applies

to

bitcoin.

It

was

really

good.

It

was

really

good.

It

surprised

the

heck

out

of

me

because

I'm

always

used

to

watching

these

like

bitcoin

lowbudget

stuff.

Linz

Yeah.

Russ

Shows

and

movies.

But

this

one

was

beyond.

Exceeded

my

expectations.

Linz

Absolutely.

It

was

very

good.

So

I

think

overarching

for

the

interview,

like,

ask

them,

you

know,

what

drove

them

to

the

film

and

the

religious

theme.

What

are

your

goals

for

the

interview

with

them?

Russ

Well,

my

goals

for

the

interview

is

to

kind

of

show

people

that

it's

not

just

a

fad

or

some

pyramid

scheme.

It's

not.

I

think

we

have

a

lot

of

normies

listening

to

the

podcast,

and

I'm

one

of

them.

Linz

Let's

be

clear.

I

don't

know

anything

about

this

stuff.

I'm

learning.

Russ

You

are.

But

the

gravity

of

bitcoin

to

change

the

world

is

so

big

that

I

think

more

people

need

to

know

about

it.

Linz

Yeah.

I

think

there's

almost

like

a

stigma

around

it.

Right.

Russ

Drug

dealers

use

it.

Linz

Well,

not

even

just

that.

It's

like

it's

a

cryptocurrency.

It

doesn't

feel

real.

Right.

And

the

barrier

to

entry

to

it.

Like,

there's

a

lot

of

aspects

to

it

that

right

now

I

think

people

just

see

it

and

are

like,

no.

But

I

can't

wait

to

talk

to

both

Brian

and

Kelly

and

really

dive

into

how

people

can

adopt

it

and

what

that

landscape

looks

like.

Russ

Yeah.

You

can't

just

print

money

out

of

thin

air.

The

fact

that

you

just

said

bitcoin

isn't

real,

but

at

the

same

breath,

you

use

the

US

Dollar

every

day

in

your

life

cracks

me

up.

Linz

Right.

Russ

Because

that's

not

real

either.

Linz

Right.

That.

That

debt

counter

that

they

have

in

the

government

just

keeps

going.

Russ

Yeah.

Linz

And

it

just

keeps

going.

Russ

They

just

try

to

print

their

money

or

print.

Print

our

money

into

oblivion.

Into

oblivion.

And

the

middle

class

is

the

class

that

gets

hurt

the

most.

Linz

This

is

going

to

be

fun.

Russ

Love

you.

Ryan

and

Kelly

Estes.

Hey,

there.

Brian Estes

Hey.

Good

morning.

Linz

Good

morning.

Russ

How

are

you?

Kelly Estes

We

are

well.

We

are

well.

Hope

you

are

awesome.

Russ

Oh,

yeah,

absolutely.

Super

excited

about

this

interview.

Yes.

Linz

We're

going

to

dive

right

in

here

and

start

with

opening

up

our

questions

for

you,

Brian

and

Kelly.

All

things

pertaining

to

God

Bless

Bitcoin

and

the

movie

that

we

actually

recently

watched

and

loved.

Great

production

value.

It

was

very

well

done.

But

we

wanted

to

know

what

drove

you

to

make

this

film.

Russ

Yeah.

Brian Estes

I

read

a

book

four

years

ago

called

thank

God

for

Bitcoin,

which

is

about

the

Christian

view

of

money,

ethics,

and

morality

and

how

they

intersect

with

bitcoin.

And

I

just

got

curious

and

I

was

like,

what

do

the

other

religions

say?

And

so

I

dove

into,

you

know,

what

Judaism,

you

know,

Islam,

Buddhist,

you

know,

Hinduism

say

about

money

and

ethics,

and.

And

that's

where

the

idea

come

from.

And,

yeah,

I

was

like,

you

know,

I.

I

had

this

internal

voice,

tell

me.

I

need

to,

like,

tell

the

story.

Like,

what

did

I

learn?

And

I've

never

written

a

book

or

made

a

movie

or.

And

I'm

terrible

at

telling

stories.

And

so

I

asked

Kelly

for

help.

I

was

like,

hey,

can

you

help

me

Develop

this

story

and

we'll

make

a

movie

and

just

share

it

with

everybody.

So

what

the

movie

is,

is

what

was

in

my

head

and

my

heart,

you

know,

and

we

made

it

and

we

put

it

on

film.

Kelly Estes

So

I

have

a

master's

degree

in

the

teaching

of

writing

and

I

work

all

the

time

with

students

to

help

them

get

their

story

out.

So

he

came

to

me

to

ask

for

help

there.

And

why

it

was

important

to

me

is

for

the

last

Almost,

I

guess,

15

years

of

my

life,

I

had

been

working

with

students

who've

grown

up

in

generational

poverty.

And

I

understand

that

the

lack

of

financial

literacy

in

our

education

system

has

put

everyone

at

a

disadvantage,

but

especially

those

who

are

the

wage

earner.

And

so

it

was

important

to

me

to

help

get

his

story

out,

to

help

educate

people.

Russ

Wow,

that's

awesome.

Linz

That's

powerful.

Oh

yeah,

for

sure.

Now

we

have

a

book

to

read.

Russ

One

thing

after

the

other.

So

my

favorite

part

of

the

film

was

how

you

did

intertwine

religion

with

Bitcoin.

You

don't

really

see

that

often.

And

what

kind

of

drove

you

to

do

that,

that

aspect

of

it?

And

intertwining

God

and

our

monetary

system?

Kelly Estes

Well,

the

whole

point

of

it

was

to

examine

money

through

a

moral

and

ethical

lens.

And

the

base

layer

of

morals

and

ethics

are

the

world's

religions

and

their

sacred

scriptures.

That

is

where

we

as

humans

are

taught

morality

and

ethics.

And

so

we

brought

in

experts

across

the

world's

religions.

So

for

Christianity,

both

Protestant

and

Catholic,

Judaism,

Islamic,

Buddhism

and

Hinduism

to

break

open

their

words

to

see

how

we

are

to

use

money

as

we

interact

with

each

other

and

to

reward

each

other

for

our

God

given

talents.

And

that

was

how

we

brought

the

two

together.

Linz

Yeah,

I

learned

so

much

in

the

aspects

of

the

different

religions

and

how

they

look

at

monetary

value

that

was

eye

opening

about

how

the

religions

really

look

at

the

monetary

system

and

how

it

was

built

throughout

religion.

Russ

Diluting

your

wine

with

water.

I

thought

that

was

an

amazing

analogy.

And

it.

It's

wild

to

think

about

how

polluted

our

monetary

system

has

gotten

over

time.

Kelly Estes

Everybody

everywhere

is

feeling

the

effects

of

inflation,

but

they

don't

understand

what's

really

causing

that.

And

what's

causing

it

is

the

money

printer.

Every

time

a

government

prints

more

money

and

puts

it

in

circulation,

it

dilutes

our

ability

to

purchase

goods

and

services.

So

we,

six

years

ago,

if

we'd

had

a

thousand

dollars

in

our

savings

account,

today

we

would

only

be

able

to

purchase

$520

worth

of

goods

and

services.

Because

in

the

United

states,

we've

printed

48%

more

dollars

in

the

last

six

years.

And

so

that's

different

for

every

country,

depending

on

how

much

they're

printing.

Brian Estes

But

so

the

money

that

you

earned

six

years

ago,

you

spent

time

and

energy

and

your

talent

to

earn

that

money,

and

now

only

buys

about

half

of

what

it

bought

six

years

ago.

And

so

that's

not

ethical,

it's

not

moral

to

steal

our

time

and

our

energy

by

doing

that.

And

so

bitcoin

stops

that

from

happening.

You

can't

print

more

bitcoin.

There's

a

finite

supply.

There's

only

21

million

Bitcoin.

And

so

that's

why

it's

a

more

ethical

and,

you

know,

moral

form

of

money

than.

Than,

you

know,

print.

You

know,

this

fiat

system

that

we're

on.

And

you

have

to

remember

the

fiat

system

that

we're

on,

it

just

started

in

1971,

pre

1971,

for

the

3,000

years

before

that,

we

use

gold

and

silver

as

money.

And

you

can't

print

gold

and

silver.

It

requires

proof

of

work.

You

have

to

go

out

and

dig

it

out

of

the

ground.

And

so

when

the

government

got

off

the

gold

and

Silver

Standard

in

1971,

they

haven't

had

the

discipline

to

not

print

money.

And

that's

what's

causing

the

problems

we

see

today.

Linz

That

debt

tracker,

right,

just

keeps

going

up.

Russ

Yeah,

it's.

It's

terrifying.

Linz

Well,

sticking

with

the

idea

of

religion

in

bitcoin

for

just

a

moment,

like

a

lot

of

people,

I

think,

have

apprehension

when

you

start

talking

about

a

global

currency

because

of

in

religion,

there's

the

mark

of

the

beast.

Right.

And

some

people

say

that

a

mark

of

the

beast

is

going

to

take

form

of

monetary,

or

it

could

take

a

form

of

something

on

a

person.

Like,

there's

different.

What

I

want

to

say,

different

viewpoints

on

what

that

could

be.

And

I've

actually

had

some

people

say

that,

well,

bitcoin

could

be

the

mark

of

the

beast.

It's

like.

Well,

I

feel

like

the

way

you

guys

answered

that

in

the

movie

is

clearly

that

this

is

a

more

ethical,

more

moral

and

aligns

with

our

values

rather

than

it

being

something

that

would

align

with

the

quote,

unquote,

mark

of

the

beast.

Kelly Estes

Right,

right.

It's

funny.

Right

now

at

our

church,

we

are

studying

the

book

of

Revelation

and

we

just

finished

that

portion

about

the

mark

of

the

beast.

And

so

one

thing

that

I

think

is

very

interesting

is

that

when

people

talk

about

bitcoin,

they

say

it's

the

most

perfect

form

of

money

humans

have

ever

created.

Right.

And

because

it

has

21

million,

it

allows

for

us

to

live

in

the

abundance

of

being

rewarded

for

the

amount

of

work

that

we

put

in.

And

so

it

is

a

better

form

of

money

than

what

we

have

now.

If

we

understand

the

mark

of

the

beast.

That

number

is

666.

That

is

the

number

just

shy

of

perfection.

God

is

perfection.

Seven

is

the

number

that

is

associated

with

completion

and

it

being

perfect.

The

seventh

day

we

rested,

our

God

rested

as

we

are

to

rest.

And

so

if

you

think

about

it

that

way,

the

fact

that

the

money,

that

bitcoin

is

a

better

form

of

money

than

what

we

have

means

that

maybe

it

is

closer

to

being

a

perfect

form

of

money.

Not

saying

that

God

blesses

it,

because

in

no

way

do

I

believe

I

am

capable

of

understanding

what

God

thinks

or

wants

or

has

intended

for

us.

I

think

the

only

thing

we

can

do

is

look

to

his

Word,

and

if

you

look

at

Revelation,

you

will

see

that

he

says

he

will

come

like

a

thief

in

the

night.

We

are

not.

The

Book

of

Revelation

is

not

about

signs

that

we

are

to

interpret

today.

The

book

of

Revelation

is

to

remind

us

to

be

ever

vigilant

and

to

stay

in

his

word,

not

to

try

to

interpret

signs

of

anything

going

on

today

in

modern

culture.

That

applies

to

something

that

was

talking

about

Roman

culture.

Linz

Wow.

That.

I

love

what

you

just

said

there.

Not

to

analyze

anything

for

today

and

just

live

in

the

now,

essentially

because

I

feel

like

a

lot

of

society

right

now

is

scare

tactics.

But

I

digress

on

that

topic.

Kelly Estes

Test

it

out.

Linz

Sorry

about

that.

That

was.

That

was

awesome.

I

really

appreciate

your

answer

on

that.

That

just

brings

so

much

perspective

to,

I

think,

the

world

that

we

currently

live

in.

Brian Estes

And

to

go

back

to

global

money,

you

know,

we

use

gold

and

silver

as

global

money.

Thousand

years.

So,

I

mean,

you

know,

bitcoin's

not

the

first

global

money,

you

know.

Linz

True.

Russ

That's

interesting.

Brian Estes

Bitcoin's

basically

a

digital

version

of

gold.

And,

you

know,

it's

better

than

gold

because

it's

more

portable

than

gold.

It's

more

divisible

than

gold.

It's

easy

to

verify,

you

know,

than

gold.

Linz

It.

It.

Brian Estes

You

know,

it's.

It's

basically

gold

with

wings

on

it.

Russ

Right,

Right.

Well,

say

that.

Linz

That's

really

right.

Russ

Yeah.

Yeah.

I

like,

you

guys

kind

of

put

out

there

in

the

movie

how

people

fleeing

oppressive

regimes

in

their.

In

their

countries.

Memorize

your

12

words

and

you

got

portable

family

wealth.

That's

insane.

Linz

They

can't

take

that

from

you.

Russ

Can't

take

that

from

you.

Like,

if

you

have

a

gold

bar

in

your

pocket,

that's

your

family's

wealth.

They're

gonna.

Obviously,

they're

gonna

take

that

if

you're

fleeing

some

kind

of

oppressive

government.

Brian Estes

I

mean,

look

what

happened

World

War

II

with

the

Jews.

You

know,

they

were,

you

know,

kicked

out

of,

you

know,

Europe,

and,

you

know,

they

had

to

leave

all

their

possessions

behind.

If

they

tried

taking

something

with

them,

you

know,

it

was

confiscated

at

the

border.

Russ

Exactly.

Brian Estes

So,

you

know,

they

were.

They

were

sewing

gold

into

their

clothes,

you

know,

and

this

way,

you

don't

have

to

do

that.

You

just.

You

memorize

the

12

words,

and

no

one

even

knows

you

have

your

money.

Linz

In

your

head

right

now.

The

perspective

you

guys

have

given

on

bitcoin,

I

mean,

is

amazing.

I

think

with

the

movie

and

everything

that

we

talked

about

so

far,

it

really.

For

someone

who.

What

do

we

call

me?

A

normie?

Someone

who

hasn't

really

grasped,

totally

grasped

the

situation

of

bitcoin,

but

I

am

appreciating

the

perspective.

But,

I

mean,

what

do

you

think

would

be

the

steps

needed

to

move

the

world

into

bitcoin?

Brian Estes

It's

education.

Only

1%

of

the

world

understands

Bitcoin

today.

You

know,

about

50%

of

Americans

own

bitcoin

or

have

exposure

to

it.

So

in

America,

we're

halfway

there.

It's

projected

by

2029.

So

just

in

five

more

years,

90%

of

Americans

will

own

bitcoin.

But

like

I

said,

it's

only

1%

of

the

world

today.

So

as

the

rest

of

the

world

becomes

educated

on

what

this

technology

could

do,

and

all

this

is

the

software,

all

bitcoin

is,

is

software,

and

it's

freedom

technology.

And

once

people

understand

this,

this

technology

and

this

freedom

that

this

software,

you

know,

enables,

you

know,

people

will

just

opt

into

it,

just

like

we

opted

into

gold

and

silver

3,000

years

ago.

Before

we

use

gold

and

silver,

we.

We

as

humans

use

salt

and

stones

and

wampum

and

beads

as

money.

And

then

gold

was

discovered,

and

we

were

like,

oh,

this

is

better

money

than.

Than,

you

know,

stones

and

shells

and

wampum.

And

so

we

use

gold

and

silver

for

3,000

years,

and

as

this

fiat

system

is

failing

today,

where

we

will

opt

in

to

the

next

system.

And

I

don't

think

we're

going

back

to

gold

because,

you

know,

I

think

we're

going

into

the

digital

version

of

gold,

which

is

called

Bitcoin,

and

as.

And

we'll

just

opt

into

it

because

it's

the

best

form

of

money

humans

have

ever

created.

You

know,

it's

better

than

gold,

and

we'll

just

opt

into

it

naturally.

Linz

Well,

I

think

that

kind

of

goes

into

our

next

question,

too,

because

if

we're

saying

that

this

is

something

that

will

naturally

be

opted

into,

in

almost

like

the

next

phase

of

the

monetary

system,

then

does

that

mean

all

other

monetary

systems

would

collapse?

Because

I

think

that

would

be

kind

of

like

a

scary

scenario

for

people

who

are

looking

at

Bitcoin

and

saying,

okay,

so

all

our

monetary

systems,

if

we

go

to

Bitcoin,

does

that

mean

these

have

to

fail?

Brian Estes

So

collapse

is

a,

seems

like

a

volatile

word,

right?

Collapse

means

like

something

that

happens

suddenly.

The

monetary

system

is

not

going

to

collapse.

The

monetary

system

will

be.

And

we've

already

see

it.

It's

being

debased.

Our

money

is

being

debased.

And

here,

here

are

some

numbers

to

put

that

in

perspective.

Right

now

there's

$35

trillion

of

U.S.

debt.

We

have

what

are

called

unfunded

liabilities.

The

present

value

of

those

is

120

trillion.

So

these

are

future

Social

Security

payments,

Medicare

payments,

retirement

payments,

the

military.

All

these

future

payments

over

the

next

30

years.

If

you

add

them

up,

the

present

value

is

120

trillion.

But

really

it's

like

200

trillion

of

actual

dollars.

So

we

have

to

print

that

money

over

the

next

30

years.

We

have

to

print

$200

trillion.

And,

and

what

that

means

is

if

more

money

gets

printed,

then

everything

becomes

more

expensive

because

the

dollars

don't

buy

as

much.

And

so

a

car

that

costs

$50,000

today,

in

30

years

it's

going

to

be

$500,000.

Home

that

cost

$500,000

today

will

cost

$5

million

in

30

years.

And

that's

mathematical

certainty

because

we

have

to

print

more

money

over

the

next

30

years

to

pay

all

these

promises

that

we've

made.

And

we

don't

have

the

money

for.

Russ

That's,

and

that's

not

just

housing

and

cars.

It's

also

food

and

it's

everything.

Yeah,

necessities,

the

things

that

you

need

to

live.

I

mean

college.

Exactly.

Brian Estes

Yeah,

right.

Russ

Heating,

heating,

just

to

survive.

And,

and

our

work

is

the

same.

That's

what

bothers

me.

It's

like

I

still

work

just

as

hard

as

I

did

six

years

ago,

but

now

it's

worth

less.

Kelly Estes

Now

you

have

to

work

harder

to

be

able

to

have

the

same

purchasing

power.

Which

is

why

you're

seeing

more

and

more

people

with

either

side

hustles

or,

or

taking

on

two

full

time

jobs.

Russ

Right.

Brian Estes

That's

why

we

start

the

movie

with

the

Brady

Bunch.

So

it

wasn't

like

that

back

in

1971

when

the

Brady

Bunch

was

around.

You

had

one

spouse

working,

the

other

spouse

staying

at

home,

raising

the

kids.

They

had

six

kids.

A

dog,

A

maid

of

one.

Right,

right.

And

so

you

could

do

that,

you

know,

back

in

1971.

The

reason

we

can't

do

that

today,

the

reason

you

have

both

parents

working

and

they

could

barely

afford

one

kid

is

because

our

money's

broken.

You

know,

it's

been

diluted.

We're

working

just

as

hard,

and

we're

not

getting

same

benefit

from

that

work.

And

bitcoin

fixes

that.

If

you

take.

If

you

go

and

work

and

earn

extra

dollars

and

you

store

them

in

bitcoin,

that

bitcoin

can't

be

diluted.

Like

your

dollars

could

be

diluted.

So

it

keeps

you

up

with

inflation.

It's

like

a

shield.

We

put

that

shield

in

the

movie.

You

know,

it

protects

you

against,

you

know,

the.

The.

The

long

arm

of

inflation

trying

to

grab

your.

Your

purchasing

power.

Russ

Right,

right,

right.

Linz

I

mean,

you

guys

have

given

us

great

perspective

today.

I.

I

am

opening

my

mind

to

the

world

of

bitcoin.

I

mean,

I.

I

think

to,

you

know,

kind

of

finish

us

off

here.

What.

What

do

you

hope

that

viewers

gain

from

the

movie?

I.

I

think

I

can

be

kind

of

an

example

of

that,

opening

my

mind

to

bitcoin.

But

ultimately,

what

do

you

hope

your

viewers

gain

from?

God

bless

bitcoin?

Kelly Estes

It's

exactly

what

you

just

said.

We

hope

that

people

who

maybe

have

been

leery

of

bitcoin

or

don't

understand

it

at

all

are

open.

Just

open

your

mind.

I'm

a

teacher,

so

I

believe

knowledge

is

power.

And

if

you

can

just

keep

an

open

mind

and

then

use

this

as

a

springboard

to

go

educate

yourself

more

so

that

you

become

more

comfortable

with

this

new

form

of

money,

I

would

say

our

movie

had

done

its

job.

And

by

the

way,

a

really

great

resource

for

learning

more

About

Bitcoin

is

Hope.com

it

has

a

space

devoted

entirely

to

education,

and

it

has

podcasts,

it

has

links

to

classes

you

can

take,

it

has

articles,

it

has

links

to

books

you

can

study.

And

so

it's

a

really

great

place

to

go

next

in

your

bitcoin

journey.

Linz

Wow.

Russ

Awesome.

Linz

Well,

we

can't

thank

you

enough

for

your

time

today.

We

could

talk

to

you

guys

for

hours.

We

really

could.

So

we

hope

to

have

you

back.

Kelly Estes

Thanks

for

doing

your

homework.

Your

questions

were

so

insightful,

and

we

really

appreciated

your

energy

this

morning.

It

was

a

great

way

for

us

to

start,

too.

Brian Estes

Yeah.

Russ

Thank

you.

We

appreciate

it.

Thank

you

so

much.

Linz

Thank

you

guys

so

much.

Hope

to

talk

to

you

again.

Kelly Estes

Take

care.

Bye.

Russ

Thank

you.

Bye.

Bye.

Linz

Thanks

for

listening

to

the

Unfiltered

Union.

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